There will be a meeting for club directors on August 7 at Westerville South High School. The meeting will begin at 9AM and conclude by 5PM. If you are unable to attend, please send a representative for your club.
[29 Jul 2005 8:24 AM]
We currently have 43 individuals representing 38 clubs that have said
they will attend the August 7 Club Directors meetings at Westerville
South High School. Al Herbert and Art Faura from the OVR staff have
also committed to attending this meeting.
I admit the response has overwhelmed me. I need help. What is the
best way to make this a productive session?
The purpose of the Club Directors' meeting, August 7, is to discuss
concerns that have been brought to the attention of the Ohio Valley
Region's Directors and staff and suggest solutions to be presented to
the OVR Board Meeting the following week.
The following concerns have been identified and are ranked in order of
importance based on input from the attending Club Directors or their
Art Faura, Al Herbert, Tom Kohl, and Bob Price will be in attendance
and act as moderators. Their role is to LISTEN to your input, explain
current OVR rules and procedures and take notes. Gretchen Niebling
(Lineshot Volleyball Club) and Michelle Hill (Toledo Volleyball Club)
have offered to help insure orderly and productive discussions.
The following are topics with comments pertaining to the August 7 meeting.
Please save additional comments for the Club Directors' meeting.
Specific tryout dates/ Specific commitment date for Juniors
Comment 1: Club level only teams having tryouts in October/November
in accordance with current rules. Offers could be made, but no
commitments allowed until one specific day. One signing day for all.
This allows the girls ample time to tryout for various teams and allows
clubs to stagger their tryouts to avoid overlapping. Much more
organized and gives the smaller clubs more opportunity to attrack
girls. Signing day recommended would be December 1.
Comment 2: I have a strong feeling about the length of tryouts going
on by clubs. Clubs in our area are having kids tryout for 3 hours and
then come back for another 3 hours or 2 hours, etc., all in one day to
monopolize the kids time from trying out at other places. I think that
we need a limit on the amount of time that a club can run each age
division of tryouts. This should help eliminate the kids in the gym
(or the parents forcing them) to tryout for so many clubs in a short
time frame. I think that we are putting too much on the kids
physically at this time. I would like to see a 3 or 4 hour maximum for
each age-group per club.
Comment 3: Set sanction fees for tryouts: I don't think any club should
be able to go above $15.00 for a player to tryout in their club if the
tryout is sanctioned. And no "at the door" another price. This is an
abuse of money. There should be a $15.00 region maximum price and that
is it if you want them sanctioned and all clubs should have sanctioned
tryouts if they want the insurance. if we are sanctioning these events
as a region, then we should be controlling them a bit more as well.
Comment 4: The 10 day waiting period is too long when the clubs in an
area all have their tryouts on the same day or within a day of each
other. I would like to see the rule revised the read 3 days after the
completion of the tryouts in an area If there are kids that live on
the border between areas and the tryouts are not completed, they could
be granted an extension. The reality is that if you are a club that
follows the rules, and does not call kids until the 10 days have
passed, you end up getting screwed by the clubs that call and badger
the kids to make a decision. And when Suzy has decided to play for
another club, does not notify you and 10 days have passed, you call and
find out she is playing for another club, you lose not only her, but the
player who would have gotten her spot-because she was already offered a
spot by the other club. Kids/Parents do not need 10 days to make a
decision. We constantly talk about protecting the athlete-well, I am
here to tell you that the clubs need to be protected by some of these
players. Actually, I would be okay with the 10 days for any players
for club teams, but not for Open teams.
Comment 5: Try-out limitations (OH rules state once season is done you
can participate in any activity you want) I have spoken to the OHSAA
compliance person to discuss our clinics/try-outs and Ohio athlete's
participation in the clinics in Oct-Nov and also try-outs. OHSAA
clearly states that once an athlete completes their season on the team
they play for they are free to participate without any eligibility
restrictions in any organized activity for that sport. Meaning if an
athlete on Seton's JV is finished on October 24th they can come to my
clinics and they can participate in a try-out. My question is why
would the OVR impose their own rule on athletes in Ohio regarding when
they can try-out or not try-out? Furthermore, if I want to run a
try-out earlier as a club for any athlete that is eligible the Region
should not have anything to say about that nor impose sanctions on a
club for running a "legal" try-out. The OVR is limiting the majority
of athletes to the OH state tournament rule. We all know the majority
of athletes that are on the remaining few teams in the state tourney in
November are already "recruited/invited" leaving the rest of the
athletes waiting. I recommend that OVR follows the OHSAA rules which
clearly state once an athlete is finished they can do whatever they
want and that if clubs want to run early try-outs for those who are
finished they should be able to attend. It is the
athlete/parents/clubs responsibility to monitor violations NOT the
Comment 1: If the field is limited-then the process for accepting
teams need to be better-this takes us into the discussion of the
"points" system-and the weight given to in region/out of region events.
Comment 2: Minimum number of tournaments a team must compete in within
the region to qualify for the bid tournament. The justification is
always that teams must go where the competition is-and that is fine,
but if you are taking advantage of the fact that OVR gets numerous bids
to Nationals, then IMHO, you have an obligation to play in region for at
least a few tournaments. There is enough competion within Ohio to have
some really strong Power Challenges IF the better teams and clubs
participate. If clubs/teams do not want to play in region, that is
fine-then those clubs and teams should use the National Qualifier
process to get to Nationals.
Comment 3: Timing of the bid. It would be nice if we could schedule
our bid tournament AFTER all of the National Qualifiers. I know this
is a logistical problem with deadlines, etc. but several states are
able to do it. Getting the teams out of the bid that have already
qualified at a National qualifier would be nice.
Comment 4: Bid Tournament (Limitations of 25 teams) This past season
the limitations were the top 25 teams in OVR seeding and my feelings are
that some of the next 10 were better than some of the top 25 based on
the kind of schedule that was kept. What about a play-in for teams
22-34 in the seeding- an additional 12 teams get the chance to get to
the bid tourney (3 pools of 4-finish 1st or 2nd and you go to the bid
tourney) making the total for the bid tourney 28 teams (7 pools of 4)
Comment 1: I think the seeding system should only be used for
IN-REGION events. No more out of region events getting points. Is all
subjective. Who cares where a team went to compete. This is not needed
to seed against each other in our region. It makes no sense to use out
of region points to seed against our own region teams. If you want a
seed then you must play in-region head to head in something to gain
points. This increases the region participation and also makes the most
logical sense (like other regions). Also, don't ever let the clubs just
get together and seed the Bid tournament. It needs to be something
concrete from our own system of seeding.
Comment 2: I know one of our concerns was the point system. It seemed
like you could buy your way to a higher seed. For example, someone
could have not won a game( or scored a single point) at one of the Open
qualifiers and received almost the same points as a team coming in 2nd
place at an 8 team tournament.(which is what most of the more local
tournaments in our region are.)
Comment 3: I think consideration needs to be given for the previous
year's finishes (most teams do not change that dramatically and that
should be a gauge to start the seeding process)How big or the number of
teams should not be the only consideration of number of points (example
we play in the SPRI elite series in Chicago which usually has 10-12 of
the top nationally ranked teams at that event-we finish 5/12 and get 7
points) Quality of the teams participating should be considered as
well. Realistically we all play the same amount of matches at any
Here is our beef-this game costs a lot of money to play and if I have
to pay for an event I want my teams playing as high a level as possible
from start to finish not just the last day-we go to Chicago because the
tourney is 200.00 our hotel is 59.00 and it is a 2 day blistering event
and one of the cheapest tournaments for the quality we could possibly
attend. If we go to the Dayton Pres Day even though it was stronger
this year we wait for good competition until the last day and pay a lot
of money and still have a hotel room charge-the ONLY reason we would go
is because you can get a lot of points for the region. This is in
direct conflict with our philosophy to "dumb down" our schedule. I am
not talking about winning anything and I am not saying that the teams
are not good enough I am saying we want to know when we play a team we
have a good chance of them beating us and we are going to fight for
every match. That is how we try to build our schedule. We play up or
we play big-now we have to modify our schedules because we finish well
at our events but we don't get many points for them.
Comment 1: Club recruiting rules are the nemesis of club
volleyball. It will always happen. However, I think we can come up with
something to help in this area. Maybe a great discussion or something at
Comment 2: It is absolutely impossible to regulate the recruiting
rules. And there is no real teeth in the enforcement. I think that a
player's obligation/committment to a club should end at the end of
JO's. If there is no enforcement of the recruiting violations and no
ramifications, coaches/clubs that recruit will continue to do so. I
have copies of emails from players from Premier that were sent to one
of our players last year blatantly recruiting this player for their
club. I talked to Jodi about it and she said, "you can't control what
these kids do" I agree, you can't. So, why bother. I think it would
be more fair and more above board to just release players at the end of
the club season. The problem is that what one percieves as polite
conversation between one club person and an athlete from another club
-is perceived as blatant recruiting by another person. And
parents/players do not want to turn in the clubs for fear of burning
bridges. Obviously, we do not want kids to be badgered by anyone,
their club or another club.
Boys' and Girls' Coed teams.
Comment 1: I think that to increase the boys volleyball in
this region it would be good to have coed teams until the age of like
13s. This will get young boys interested and create more kids playing.
Maybe 12s or 13s?
Comment 1: Tournaments should be considered independent tournaments if
they are being run at different sites and on different weekends. Since
the OVR does not allow multiple sites for tournaments within a division
then this should be the rule. Each one is considered a different
tournament. For example, if a player competes in one tournament one
day, they can compete in the other tournament on a different day since
they are two separate events.
Also, with tournaments comes invites: I think we need to have good,
solid invitationals. Dayton and Premier have both established solid
invites but yet they are being constrained to a set entry fee, format,
etc. I would like to see Invites be able to have a bit more
flexibility in both areas in order to attract out of region teams to
our region for them.
Comment 2: Invites/Challenges should be invitational-everyone can
enter but selection is based on invitation that a coaches committee
could be responsible for. Last year's national finishes, regional
finishes, bid finishes could be a part of the criteria-no team is going
to get significantly worse than the year before so it is a safe
criteria. Secondly, most of the top teams have already played in 2-3
events by March and those are the kinds of teams that should be in the
regional challenges/invites in the first place if you are going for the
top teams-if not this is a moot point. You all always ask us why we
don't play and I guarantee we all say the same thing the competition
for the price is not there.
Selection subjectivity is always going to be in place regardless and
I would rather have coaches who have seen the teams or understand the
levels have input into what teams are invited-because as a whole, the
tournament will be better for it-will some teams be left out yes but
the majority chosen will insure we have a quality event. Secondly, the
majority of these challenges and invite events fill before teams even
had a chance to consider them-many were over booked and if they are
then that is where a selection process is most valuable- entry deadline
is in place and the number of teams limited and you choose from the pool
that entered and notify the day after deadline who is in or not or an
invitational. Also, I know the venue dictates where you can hold
them-it is no secret that between greater cincinnati and greater
dayton area you have 5 of the top 8 clubs in the region in all age
divisions (teamz, classics, nkyvc, dayton jr, team atlantis, younger
ages cincy vbc) and a host of other strong clubs like cincy vbc,
swthunderbirds) If you host the events in these areas we will all play
in them. The majority rule again. (that means that tvc, premier
travel not the rest of us) It should be about what we can do to make
these events the highest level. With that being said you can also host
other challenges to accommodate all the other clubs interested in
these events (so when you publish these you state the 2 locations that
will host the challenge if selected
-invitation goes to site A and non-invitational goes to Site B so
everyone has a tourney to play in but a selection process is used to
identify who goes to which group.
Tournament Entry procedures
Comment 1: I think we did a good job with the new tournament entry
procedures this year and making sure that everyone knew the rules of
taking spots, etc. However, lets make it a priority this year to make
sure that everyone knows the rules so there is less confusion.
Comment 1: Yes! More teams. We are one of the largest regions in the
country and we are only choosing one team per division? We need two in
each. We need to give more kids opportunities in this area. I thought
the tryout process was well run, but returning kids should not be
automatically chosen. We need better evaluating and more coaches
working. A discussion of to do this would be good I think. Also, we
need good, solid coaching. I know that CAP is a USA volleyball
requirement, but we have some terrific college coaches that would be a
great experience for the kids to work with. Get them on college
campuses and work with college coaches, not just club coaches.
Cost of OVR events
Comment 1: The CCC events are too expensive-I don't know what to
tell you maybe you can have clubs volunteer to set-up and breakdown as
part of keeping the costs down perhaps you already do that.
Comment 1: Discussion on NCAA rules about giving scholarships to club players.
Comment 2: Discussion on NCAA rules about 50 mile radius for club
coaches.-These two items would require some advance work-asking the
NCAA compliance department for their rulings and a layman's
interpretation of those rules.